We adopted a horsefield tortoise from a nursing home in March last year but they didn't really know much about him. We think he's about 6 but didn't hibernate him this year after reading the advice if we're not sure then wait until we've had him a year. He slowed down before Christmas, eating only small amounts, digging for hours and sleeping alot. We assumed this was normal with him wanting to hibernate. We changed his soil, built him a wooden shelter and continuously tried him with food and bathed him daily. After 2 weeks of no poos we took him to the vet who said he was 'puffy' and treated him for a chest infection. We've had to take him back to the vets everyday for the last 3 weeks to be tube fed because he's still not interested in his food.
Yesterday we got him out in the sunny garden and noticed bruising all round his neck where they've been tube feeding him and it just broke my heart. We've asked the vet if we can have him home for a few days to avoid the stress and hopefully make him want to eat. He's agreed but we need to take him straight back if he's not eaten by Saturday.
He's one hell of a fussy tortoise but is there anything you guys would especially try as a treat to temp him?
I just don't want to carry on taking him to vets everyday, surely we can't carry on like this?
Anyone had a similar experience?
Horsefield tortoise being tube fed at the vets
Re: Horsefield tortoise being tube fed at the vets
Hi Gemcas,
Welcome to The Tortoise Table and it was really good of you to adopt this Horsfield! They are a lovely species with lots of personality. I am so sorry that you have been having problems with him, but hopefully we can help you to get him eating again.
First of all, you were right in not hibernating him this year, because we always advise that you have a tortoise for a year before hibernating. This is so that you can get to know him well and will be able to tell whether he is in excellent health before hibernating, which is very important. However, it can be very difficult (as you have seen) to keep a Horsfield awake all winter because they have very strong hibernation instincts.
I am slightly concerned about the treatment your vet is giving him. Your vet is probably absolutely fine, but we always recommend that a tortoise is seen by an exotics/reptile vet, rather than an ordinary vet, because unless the training given on reptiles, birds, fish, etc. in vet schools amounts to only about three weeks, unless the student specifies that he is particularly interested in exotics, and we know of ordinary vets who have caused lasting damage to tortoises (and in some cases, death) by prescribing the wrong medicines. This is why we have a list of recommended exotics vets on our website. Could you possibly email me the name of the practice so that i can check if they employ an 'exotics' vet? My email is nina@thetortoisetable.org.uk
As I said, Horsfields have a particularly strong hibernation instinct, and sometimes there is nothing you can do to get them eating when they decide they want to hibernate, but it can be possible and temperature and light are the keys to doing this. Basically you need to fool the tortoise into thinking that it is a bright summer's day, so very bright light and the right temperature is essential. Regarding temperature, you want it to be 30C directly under his light/heat source, measured at the height of his shell (not with a thermometer that is attached to a nearby wall), and as bright a light as possible too, and about 20C at the cooler end of his enclosure. Could you possibly post a photo of your set-up? We might be able to suggest little tweaks that could help. In the meantime, here is our guide to keeping a tortoise awake all winter if this is necessary: https://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk/tor ... D38edynyM8
Actually, rather than me writing an excessively long post, it might be easier to have a chat on the phone. I would be happy to ring you at a time that is convenient for you, or you could ring me if you prefer. Would that be acceptable? It is just that this seems to me a rather urgent situation, and a talk on the phone can sometimes speed up things, rather than going back and forth with posts. Please don't post a phone number here, but if you email be at the address I gave above, I will happily send you my phone number or you could send me yours if you are happy to do that (but if you prefer to continue on the forum here that is fine).
I would definitely like to get some more information and suggest a few things before you take him back for more tube feeding. And don't worry about him going without food for a few days or a week or so -- tortoises can go a very long time without food, but it is essential that they are well hydrated, so it's great that you are giving him daily baths, and do keep those up. You obviously want the very best for this little tortoise, and I think he is lucky to have found a home with you. Hopefully we will be able to get him eating again and back to full health.
Nina
Welcome to The Tortoise Table and it was really good of you to adopt this Horsfield! They are a lovely species with lots of personality. I am so sorry that you have been having problems with him, but hopefully we can help you to get him eating again.
First of all, you were right in not hibernating him this year, because we always advise that you have a tortoise for a year before hibernating. This is so that you can get to know him well and will be able to tell whether he is in excellent health before hibernating, which is very important. However, it can be very difficult (as you have seen) to keep a Horsfield awake all winter because they have very strong hibernation instincts.
I am slightly concerned about the treatment your vet is giving him. Your vet is probably absolutely fine, but we always recommend that a tortoise is seen by an exotics/reptile vet, rather than an ordinary vet, because unless the training given on reptiles, birds, fish, etc. in vet schools amounts to only about three weeks, unless the student specifies that he is particularly interested in exotics, and we know of ordinary vets who have caused lasting damage to tortoises (and in some cases, death) by prescribing the wrong medicines. This is why we have a list of recommended exotics vets on our website. Could you possibly email me the name of the practice so that i can check if they employ an 'exotics' vet? My email is nina@thetortoisetable.org.uk
As I said, Horsfields have a particularly strong hibernation instinct, and sometimes there is nothing you can do to get them eating when they decide they want to hibernate, but it can be possible and temperature and light are the keys to doing this. Basically you need to fool the tortoise into thinking that it is a bright summer's day, so very bright light and the right temperature is essential. Regarding temperature, you want it to be 30C directly under his light/heat source, measured at the height of his shell (not with a thermometer that is attached to a nearby wall), and as bright a light as possible too, and about 20C at the cooler end of his enclosure. Could you possibly post a photo of your set-up? We might be able to suggest little tweaks that could help. In the meantime, here is our guide to keeping a tortoise awake all winter if this is necessary: https://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk/tor ... D38edynyM8
Actually, rather than me writing an excessively long post, it might be easier to have a chat on the phone. I would be happy to ring you at a time that is convenient for you, or you could ring me if you prefer. Would that be acceptable? It is just that this seems to me a rather urgent situation, and a talk on the phone can sometimes speed up things, rather than going back and forth with posts. Please don't post a phone number here, but if you email be at the address I gave above, I will happily send you my phone number or you could send me yours if you are happy to do that (but if you prefer to continue on the forum here that is fine).
I would definitely like to get some more information and suggest a few things before you take him back for more tube feeding. And don't worry about him going without food for a few days or a week or so -- tortoises can go a very long time without food, but it is essential that they are well hydrated, so it's great that you are giving him daily baths, and do keep those up. You obviously want the very best for this little tortoise, and I think he is lucky to have found a home with you. Hopefully we will be able to get him eating again and back to full health.
Nina
Re: Horsefield tortoise being tube fed at the vets
Hi there
I wondered if anyone could help?
I have a 3 year old horsefield called frank.
We bought him from a reptile shop and was advised a large viv etc, after a year he started to become excessively sleepy and refusing to eat (it was a heatwave at the time)
The specialist vet thought it was an environmental so we changed him into a table (2mx1m) with a heat lamp at 30 degresss at the hot end and a heat mat under the covered bit at the end.
I had to inject him daily with antibiotics which didn’t do anything then he was tube fed for a month which he responded to. We also had to treat with anti inflammatories and working treatment as they’d found high amounts of worms eggs in his stool sample. He’s rallied since however over the last few weeks he’s closed his eyes again, would only eat a nibble of dandelion and watermelon however has now stopped completely. Have taken him to the vets yesterday and they’ve given me Injectable antibiotics again and he’s having another tube put into his neck today. Does anyone have any experience with this? Why does this keep happening? He’s only 3 so not fully grown (about size of an adults palm) but I’m scared this will happen every year. Last year he didn’t eat for nearly 6 months!!! I adore him and hate seeing him like this!
I wondered if anyone could help?
I have a 3 year old horsefield called frank.
We bought him from a reptile shop and was advised a large viv etc, after a year he started to become excessively sleepy and refusing to eat (it was a heatwave at the time)
The specialist vet thought it was an environmental so we changed him into a table (2mx1m) with a heat lamp at 30 degresss at the hot end and a heat mat under the covered bit at the end.
I had to inject him daily with antibiotics which didn’t do anything then he was tube fed for a month which he responded to. We also had to treat with anti inflammatories and working treatment as they’d found high amounts of worms eggs in his stool sample. He’s rallied since however over the last few weeks he’s closed his eyes again, would only eat a nibble of dandelion and watermelon however has now stopped completely. Have taken him to the vets yesterday and they’ve given me Injectable antibiotics again and he’s having another tube put into his neck today. Does anyone have any experience with this? Why does this keep happening? He’s only 3 so not fully grown (about size of an adults palm) but I’m scared this will happen every year. Last year he didn’t eat for nearly 6 months!!! I adore him and hate seeing him like this!
Re: Horsefield tortoise being tube fed at the vets
Oh dear, I'm so sorry that your tortoise is so unwell! Your vet was right to change him from a vivarium into a table, and it's good to know that he rallied for a while. I'm glad you are seeing a specialist vet (I'm assuming that you are seeing the same vet that you saw before).
We aren't vets, but we do have years of experience with tortoises that are unwell. Can I ask if the vet ran any tests before he prescribed the antibiotics yesterday? Also, what does the vet say is the problem (i.e. what sort of infection or condition doe your tortoise have)?
Temperature is absolutely crucial to the appetite and energy levels of a tortoise. When he was in the viv, it probably got way too hot for him and that is why he was lethargic. Because tortoises are ectothermic (meaning they don't make their own body heat like mammals do, and their body temperature depends on the temperature of their environment), they need two zones of temperature in their eclosures. At the warm end the temperature should be about 30C and that must be measured directly under the lamp and at the height of their shell -- and not measured by a thermometer mounted on a nearby wall). At the other end of the enclosure it should be about 20C. That way he will be able to wander from warm to cool zones to regulate his body temperature.
He shouldn't need any heat at night, but (and I'm sure the vet will have told you this), if he is on antibiotics his enclosure should be warm 24/7, so you will have to provide some extra heat at night while his lights are off. Can I also ask where the heat mat is? If it is mounted on a wall or the ceiling of covered bit then that is fine (although in normal circumstances you wouldn't need to have it on). If, however, it is on the floor of the table, under the substrate, then it needs to be taken out, because even low wattage heat mats, covered by substrate, can produce burns on the underside of tortoises if they sit on them for long enough.
It sounds like tempting him with food might not work at this point, but you could try offering him a thin, peeled slice of cucumber. Tortoises often can't resist cucumber, so although we wouldn't advise feeding it regularly it's good for situations like this and also for administering medicine.
Could you possibly post a photo of his set-up? I know how stressful and worrying this must be for you, and you obviously love him very much. We'll do our best to support you and offer advice, and hopefully with all of our efforts, we can get him going again.
Nina
We aren't vets, but we do have years of experience with tortoises that are unwell. Can I ask if the vet ran any tests before he prescribed the antibiotics yesterday? Also, what does the vet say is the problem (i.e. what sort of infection or condition doe your tortoise have)?
Temperature is absolutely crucial to the appetite and energy levels of a tortoise. When he was in the viv, it probably got way too hot for him and that is why he was lethargic. Because tortoises are ectothermic (meaning they don't make their own body heat like mammals do, and their body temperature depends on the temperature of their environment), they need two zones of temperature in their eclosures. At the warm end the temperature should be about 30C and that must be measured directly under the lamp and at the height of their shell -- and not measured by a thermometer mounted on a nearby wall). At the other end of the enclosure it should be about 20C. That way he will be able to wander from warm to cool zones to regulate his body temperature.
He shouldn't need any heat at night, but (and I'm sure the vet will have told you this), if he is on antibiotics his enclosure should be warm 24/7, so you will have to provide some extra heat at night while his lights are off. Can I also ask where the heat mat is? If it is mounted on a wall or the ceiling of covered bit then that is fine (although in normal circumstances you wouldn't need to have it on). If, however, it is on the floor of the table, under the substrate, then it needs to be taken out, because even low wattage heat mats, covered by substrate, can produce burns on the underside of tortoises if they sit on them for long enough.
It sounds like tempting him with food might not work at this point, but you could try offering him a thin, peeled slice of cucumber. Tortoises often can't resist cucumber, so although we wouldn't advise feeding it regularly it's good for situations like this and also for administering medicine.
Could you possibly post a photo of his set-up? I know how stressful and worrying this must be for you, and you obviously love him very much. We'll do our best to support you and offer advice, and hopefully with all of our efforts, we can get him going again.
Nina
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