Advice about puffy and closed eyes

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 11 Jul 2017, 07:10

Hi Jayne,
Thanks so much for updating us, and this is good news, I think! Hopefully the vet will find out the cause of the swollen eyes tomorrow, and be able to make him well again! We'll be thinking of you and Barry, and it's good that he has eaten -- even if it's only a little.

Nina x

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Elaine
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Elaine » 11 Jul 2017, 08:26

Thanks for the update. You really are doing everything possible for Barry.

We'll all be thinking of you both.

Sorry if I've missed this, what's the vet's name?

Elaine 🐢
Elaine on behalf of The Tortoise Table (T.T.T.).

Jayne1964
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Jayne1964 » 11 Jul 2017, 22:14

Well my Barry baby came home from the vets at 7pm this evening, groggy but otherwise Unphased by it all. Mark the vet told me once they were able to get his eyelids open - not an easy task on such a small tort, he could see grit and skin from his shedding, who would have thought! He has flushed is eyes completely and sent him home with Maxitrol eye drops. I have to go back Monday for a post op check up but fingers crossed the op and the eye drops start to aliviate his problem and he is soon opening his eyes and back to his normal hungry Horsfield self.
The vet I use is called Mark Taylor, Felton veterinary centres ltd, 94-96 King st, Bedworth, CV12 8JF.
I was talking to Mark about him being the nearest vet to me with reptile experience - there are non in Coventry, and we are a city, small city but you would have hoped at least one reptile specialist. Mark said that when he is on holiday and a reptile comes in, the practice have to call upon vet in Loughborough to help...that's quite a distance.

Teddy28
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Teddy28 » 11 Jul 2017, 22:25

Been reading your posts and so glad to hear your little chap sounds like he s on the mend. xx

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 11 Jul 2017, 22:27

Thanks, Jayne, that is brilliant news! I think Mark sounds like an excellent vet and we will add their practice to our list. I'm so pleased that Barry is on the mend. Did Mark say how he thought the problem occurred, or how you could prevent it from happening again?
This is such great news -- has really made my day! Give Barry a nice little tickle under his chin from me.

Nina

Jayne1964
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Jayne1964 » 12 Jul 2017, 06:23

Thanks everyone, I did ask if the grit was possibly part of the playsand and from his substrate, I use 70/30 topsoil and play sand, he said could be but as he a Horsfield it could have been while burrowing in the garden, outside enclosure. I asked if I should omit the sand when I change his substrate next time, he said leave it as it is for now, do not want to stress him after his op and that is what he is used to. Skin came from his head, he even said that may have happened after the initial irritation and as Barry has rubbed his eyes with legs this has pulled the shedding skin away and unfortunately that just added further to the irritation as it went in his eye. I have just been sitting here thinking about my late Dad. In the 70s when all my friends were getting tortoises he would not let me have one because in his words "there is a lot more involved in looking after a tortoise than you think, it's not just putting them in the garden and leaving them" lol...if he was alive now he would be smugly saying "see, I told you so".....ha,ha well I'm happy, they are worth the effort.
I have just looked at my last post, The vet is FELDONs, not FELTONs for some reason iPad loves changing things

Jayne1964
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Jayne1964 » 12 Jul 2017, 06:25

Thanks Teddy28 ..scary times, you feel helpless but fingers crossed this has worked

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 12 Jul 2017, 08:10

I think the fact that you regularly spray the substrate would mean there was less chance of that happening from the substrate indoors, but you never know. In the wild they come from dry areas with a very sandy soil, so you have only been providing him with what he would have had naturally. Hopefully now he will recover quickly and all will be well!

Your father was a very wise man! That is exactly what we still say to people who are casually thinking of getting a tortoise and haven't done any research.

Do keep us updated on Barry's progress.

Nina x

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Elaine
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Elaine » 13 Jul 2017, 15:30

Hi Jayne,

I had read your positive news about Barry yesterday but had a migraine so couldn't reply.

What a fantastic outcome. Just go to show how a simple thing can then become so complicated. I take it the eye drops we suggested that showed a little improvement we're just soothing the eyelid which let Barry open it slightly. So pleased no damage was done to the surface of the eye.

Well done for perseverance!!
Elaine
Elaine on behalf of The Tortoise Table (T.T.T.).

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 13 Jul 2017, 16:51

Hi Jayne,
I hope that Barry continues to improve. This is just to let you know that we have added Feldon Veterinary Centre to our list of Vets. It sounds like you and Barry had excellent treatment there, so hopefully others in the area will now use it too.

Cheers,
Nina

Jayne1964
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Jayne1964 » 16 Jul 2017, 14:43

Hi folks,
Little update...we have 1 eye beginning to ope!! Now it is only a slight crack..but more than we have had for past fortnight so we are extremely excited. Still on his eye drops from vet. Hoping now there is a slight crack the eyedrop will start working its magic. Eating but not as much as pre eye trouble but hey..he us eating! Trying to wran him off the mushy pellets and hand feeding but still need to virtually place/rub into his nose for him to start nibbling..but I am grateful. My sons friend is going to have ago at making me a table so hopefully get that once he has a mo. Thanks for putting Feldons on, he has been great with Barry. Back there tomorrow for post op check.[attachment=1]20170716_143509.jpg[/attachment][attachment=0]20170716_143515.jpg[/attachment]
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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 16 Jul 2017, 20:08

Hi Jayne,

So sorry that no one has responded to your post! I've been out all afternoon and I guess the others have too -- but it is great to hear that Barry is making progress -- even if it is slow progress. And the fact that he is eating something is good -- I guess that if he can't see the food then it is less tempting for him, so you are doing a great job. Barry is a real trooper, and I hope that the prognosis at the vet tomorrow is good. Thanks so much for keeping us updated, and I look forward to hearing more good news!

Nina

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Elaine
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Elaine » 16 Jul 2017, 20:49

Oh Jayne this must have cheered you up no end. It takes such a long time for things to show up in a tortoise and even longer for them to get better so even such a small glimmer of hope is massive!

You could try rubbing the juice of cucumber or red pepper on his weeds or flowers to help trigger his appetite through smell. If you have Hibiscus this is a favourite as is nasturtiums both worth a try.

Thanks for sharing Barry's good news, it really is very much appreciated.
Elaine
Elaine on behalf of The Tortoise Table (T.T.T.).

Teddy28
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Teddy28 » 16 Jul 2017, 22:21

That's brilliant news, I hope Barry continues to improve, he's a lucky little chap.

Jayne1964
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Jayne1964 » 16 Jul 2017, 22:47

Thanks all! Nasturtiums and lavatera are his favourites, but he has been turning his nose up at those. Unfortunately I must have the only tortoise who will not et cucumber, I try all the time, but he nudges it then quickly pulls his head into his shell, same sort of reaction my boys used to have to cabbage and broccoli lol. I know sight plays a big part in the foods he goes to and decides to eat, unlike most Horsfields mine has never been an overwater. He has always just eaten enough then moved away, so not worried as long as he eats something. I am bathing him daily in Reptoboast at the moment - every little bit helps! I know this will be a long road to recovery, just hoping the vet does not say he has lost his sight..that would be so sad..but not thinking about that yet. Thankyou all for your advice, I have tweaked his enclosure so much so it is much appreciated and has not fallen on deaf ears.

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 16 Jul 2017, 22:53

You are really a great keeper, Jayne, and you're doing a brilliant job. A Horsfield that doesn't like cucumber? What is Barry playing at? :D

Nina

Teddy28
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Teddy28 » 19 Jul 2017, 20:53

My little chap also turns his nose up at cucumber.....In fact he goes one step better, he tramples over it!

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 19 Jul 2017, 22:28

:D :D They never fail to surprise me! One of mine adores the narrow-leaf Plantain but turns her nose up at the broadleaf Plantain!

Nina :D

Jaipe
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Jaipe » 03 Jun 2018, 22:05

Hi Jayne. Sorry to bump this thread, but I'm just wondering how Barry got on in the end?

My little buddy, Jarvis, is having very very similar issues. Walking around with his eyes closed. So I'm wondering if it did turn out to be the grit/skin causing the irritation (in both eyes?)

Hope Barry is fit and well!

John

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 03 Jun 2018, 22:25

Hi John,
So sorry to hear that your tortoise isn't well. Eyes closed can be a symptom of several things, some of which can be serious. Do you have a good reptile vet that you could consult (it needs to be a reptile or 'exotics' vet, not an ordinary vet). If you don't have one, we have a list of recommended vets for tortoises, listed by areas in the UK, here: https://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk/tor ... xRcMiAh2M8
Let us know if you need any help.

Nina

Jaipe
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Jaipe » 04 Jun 2018, 21:25

Hi Nina

Thanks for your reply.

I took Jarvis to a few different Pets at Home reptile vets. The first one gave me some emergency vitamin supplement and some oral antibiotics. I gave him the course of antibiotics, but they didn't help (this was around 3-4 weeks ago now), I have continued giving him the supplement.

The second vet examined his eyes, gave me some anti biotic eye gel, some "energy" powder to put in his bath and gave him a deworming (poor guy :-( ). She said to come back if he doesn't improve and they'll do a blood test.

He's still eating, but roams around with his eyes closed. When he opens them they look completely fine, but he doesn't want to. And he rubs them quite a lot, as if they're irritated.

I've changed his substrate from wood chipping (which he had when the problem first started) to top soil. No change.

I think it may be due to the UVB bulb he has, which is a bit flickery and quite bright. I think this because he tends to hide away in the dark of his hut, even on nice days. So I've bought a new 75w exoterra basking light and am going to see how he goes with that.

Thanks again

John

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Nina
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Nina » 04 Jun 2018, 22:34

Hi John,

Oh dear, you and Jarvis are really going through a difficult time. Are you absolutely sure that the Pets at Home vets are qualified exotics vets? If they are then that is fine. Re the vitamin supplement -- do you know if this was Vitamin A? If so then that can sometimes be a problem, as tortoises can have a bad reaction to high doses of vitamin A (but that usually only happens if they are given it by injection). It sounds, though, that Jarvis didn't have a bad reaction -- he just didn't get better.

It is possible that Jarvis has worms, but did the Vet test a sample of his poo to see if there was a high load of worm eggs in it first? Whenever you go to the vet it's a good idea to take a fresh sample of poo so that it can be tested for worms and other parasites.

Top soil is a much better substrate than wood chippings, so well done for changing that. Do you know what kind of wood it was? The reason I ask is that pine can give off unpleasant fumes when it is warmed up. Do spray the topsoil every day or two to keep it from getting too dusty (which can irritate the eyes).

Regarding the UVB light. Can you tell me what sort of UVB light it was (was it one that delivered heat as well as UVB and light?). A very bright light should be no problem at all for a tortoise, and in fact they prefer a bright light (although the flickering doesn't sound so good). As far as I can see, the
Exoterra 75W basking light is just a heat/light and UVA bulb and doesn't emit UVB. It is really important that your tortoise has UVB, so if this new bulb doesn't emit UVB then you could get a UVB fluorescent tube to supplement it, or you will need to get another lamp that does produce UVB, as without that your tortoise won't be able to utilise the calcium in his diet to produce healthy bone and shell.

It just occurred to me that sometimes these problems can occur because the set-up is not quite balanced and a small tweak here and there can put it right. Can you confirm that Jarvis is in an open tortoise table and not a glass and wood enclosed vivarium? Also temperature is usually the most important factor in a tortoise set-up. Can you tell us what the temperature is directly below the heat source, at the height of Jarvis's shell, and also what the temperature is at the cool end of his set-up? It should be around 30C (not much more) at hot end and around 20C at the cool end, and please measure it directly below the lamp, as a thermometer mounted on a nearby wall will give a very inaccurate reading.

I'm so sorry to bombard you with all these questions, but I can tell that you are a good tortoise keeper who wants Jarvis to have the best possible life, and sometimes the only way to get to the root of the problem is to ask lots of questions (so many apologies, but I hope that we can come up with some suggestions to help you. If you want to send us some photos of your set-up, that would be great too, but the temperature is the most important thing we need to know at the moment.

Nina

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lin
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by lin » 05 Jun 2018, 16:27

Hi John.
I have to agree with Nina, and say your vet really must be an exotic vet that specalises in tortoises and not one that see's the run of the mill furrys.
Can you also let us know if you hibernated Jarvis.

Lin

Olivereastham
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by Olivereastham » 06 May 2019, 18:55

My tortoise Freddie seems to be having a similar problem and we are gonna see a vet this week. Has anyone got any extra advice or knowledge about this problem

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lin
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Re: Advice about puffy and closed eyes

Post by lin » 06 May 2019, 19:12

Afraid not Olivereastham. I have been reading that a lot of horsfields seem to be having this problem and I can only put it down to the cold snap we are experiencing right now or a slight tweek in heat or husbandry might be needed. Do you have your tortoise in very very slightly moist (not in the least wet) soil as a substrate and do you provide a humid hide?

Lin

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