Weight loss

[Jo1211]

I had a clear worm count and started to wind down my horsfield tortoise ready for hibernation. I am now at the end of the 2nd week of wind down and planning on doing 2 more weeks before she goes in the fridge ( which I have set up ready ).
I’ve weighed her today and she has lost 12g during these 2 weeks. I know that it says 10% during hibernation but does this include wind down? Should I continue with the wind down?
Any help please?

[Nina]

Hi Jo,

How much does your tortoise weigh? It's all sort of relative. I've always assumed that the 10% weight loss guideline applied only to hibernation (and depending on weight, 12g lost in wind down might not be a reason for concern), but to be honest I'm not completely sure, and I think that the current thinking is that you shouldn't let your tortoise even approach the 10% loss anyway. Also, depending on the weight of your tortoise, a two-week or three-week wind down is more appropriate than a four week wind down. Are you bathing him regularly to keep him well hydrated? Just give me a bit more information and I'll do my best to help.

Nina

[Jo1211]

She weighed 470g at the start of wind down. Now 2 weeks in she weighs 458g.
I bathe her in alternate days and she passed some urates 2 days ago but hasn’t pooed since wind down started.

When I bathe her for around 20 mins then I weigh her afterwards and then put her back under her heat lamp. Within minutes she is back in the corner of the table partly buried down.
She is fast asleep when I get her up for her bath so I gently wake her.

[Nina]

Thanks for the information, Jo. I think that at 470g a three-week wind down should be sufficient. The Tortoise Trust recommend a wind down of three weeks for any tortoise that weighs less than 1 kg, but stipulate that it shouldn't be less than 3 weeks. What sort of temperatures and hours of light and heat have you been giving -- are they being gradually reduced? It's great that you are bathing her, and she might well still have a poo. As long as any food she has eaten has moved from her stomach into her gut there isn't a problem. It's only if there is food remaining in the stomach that it is dangerous, because that can turn bad and give off toxic gas. Tortoises often have a poo during hibernation, and this is fine and means that the poo was in their gut (not their stomach) before they went in.

Regarding the 12g. Even if you were to take the wind down weight loss into account, there is still some way to go before you reach 10% (which would be 47g), plus tortoises usually lose far less weight in hibernation than they do during wind down, because their systems have slowed down and they aren't burning fat. My torts usually lose between 4g - 10g in 12 or 13 weeks hibernation, so if your tortoise is the same then it should be fine.

Where are you hibernating her (box or fridge)? I know that it's super nerve wracking and stressful, this whole hibernation business, but it sounds to me like you are doing well. Please do come back with any more questions that you have and any additional information you want to provide.

Nina

[Jo1211]

Thank you Nina

I’ve had her for the first week on 12 hours as usual and under the lamp is 32 degrees and 25 on the outer area.
Then I went down to 8 hours light and heat and intend to go to 4 hours for week 3.
I have got a fridge set up in a utility room and the temperature has ranged between 2-6 degrees. I am trying to get it to settle on 3 but have 3 thermometers with sensors and alarms attached so it doesn’t drop lower than 2 or go higher than 7.
Would bathing her daily help with the weight loss? I’ve put the plastic box with shredded paper in the fridge already so I can make sure they are stable before she goes in.


Thank you again
Jo

[Nina]

Hi Jo,

That sounds fine, but I think I would aim for no more than 30C directly under the lamp. For the last day, and then add on one additional day before you put her in the fridge, I would have no light or heat, and have her in a room with the door closed and the windows open, if possible, to get the temperature down even more before she goes in the fridge, so she is already pretty cold when she goes in and it's not a shock.

The ideal to aim for in the fridge is 5C and a range of 2C to 8C or 9C is OK (as long as it isn't at 8C or 9C for any length of time). 2C is OK as long as your thermometers are accurate. They are often off by a degree or so, so I usually aim for it to go no lower than 3C, on the assumption that my thermometer might be a degree off (there is an easy way to test them if that I can let you know about). Having said all that, it is well known that Horsfields can take lower temperatures than most other species, so even if it is reading 2C but is actually 1C there shouldn't be a big problem.

One thing that is good to do is to fill some of empty spaces in the fridge with bottles of water. These need several days to cool down before the tortoise goes in, but once they reach the temperature of the fridge you then have a mass of water at, say, 5C, so if the temperature suddenly rises or falls, that mass of water at 5C keeps the fridge temperature more steady, with less fluctuation. I also have a small open bowl of water sitting in the fridge, as the atmosphere of a fridge is quite dry, and that can help add a bit of humidity.

You are already bathing her regularly throughout the wind down, so that is good, as it's really important that she goes into hibernation with a full bladder. If she wees while in hibernation then you need to wake her up and take her out -- but this doesn't often happen. I was just thinking that maybe she had had a wee at some point during wind down, and that could account for a bit of the weight loss, and in the next bath she might replenish that water.

Good luck and let us know how you get on!

Nina